I'll try to carry this discussion that began in mwither's poll / thread T-Wolves starting five and first three of the bench over into the new forum...

DeROK wrote in the old forum:
I'll say:
Yeah, like I wrote initally when introducing my top 8 rotation players, I understand that an important part of developing young players is to \"put them in a winning enviroment\" and you surely won't achieve this by playing everybody under 25 you have on your roster all the time. But to be honest, I do not expect the Wolves to be able to offer this kind of situation anyway any time soon, no matter who they play. And a playoff spot? Sure, that would be nice...no, TREMENDOUS, but I don't see how this fresh team of mostly young players that sucked in Boston and Minny already should surpass one of the other teams fighting for the last playoff spot. I would prefer at least another chance to add some talent through the draft compared to the right to get swept in the first round by San Antonio, Phoenix or...ehm...some other franchise from Texas ! But since this franchise won't be going to the Playoffs anyways...what do we gain by adding three or five wins except for loosing ping-pong-balls? That won't create a \"winning enviroment\"...the Wolves are in a situation they haven't been in for year: To build around a young core that has it's best years probably still ahead of them. Going for a \"win now\" apporach by playing mediocre vets instead of promising youngsters - as the Wolves have been while they wasted KGs carreer away - and settling for early playoff exits or bad lottery positions will only create a second coming of the same vicious circle the Wolves' braintrust has already proven to be unable to break free from.

Much like College Wolf, I don't see Brewer starting in any of the first 20 games of the season anyways, but considering the situation the Wolves are in - namely to develop a team ready to go deep in the Playoffs over the next three years when Al Jefferson reaches his prime - I would like to have one of the supposed future cornerstones of this team not burried on somewhere on the bench but on the field as much as possible. Let the minutes (maybe 15-20 per night) be his to loose and try to find out if he can be what you are hoping for sooner than later. The years go by faster than someone might think, and someday the time to find a supporting cast for Big Al will be gone for good while the Wolves' played role players at the verge of their 30s.

I like the idea of Gomes starting over Brewer but hopefully Brewer will get at least 15-20 mpg. The main difference of opinion that I have from the majority of the bloggers in the contest is that Smith and Jefferson should be starting in the majority of the games at the 4 and 5 respectively. I don't think there is any reason to start Blount at all if he is still on the team. He adds size but he doesn't know how to use it. Jefferson is a beast and played some C for the Celtics last year. I believe that Smith may be too small to start against a few teams such as the Suns and the Spurs, but he should be fine otherwise.
Most would say that this could hurt chemistry between the normal starters and it may in some instances. However, adjusting the starting lineup based on the opposing team is not only the smart thing to do competitive-wise but it can also open up your eyes to talent that would normally play off the bench. This would work great considering all of the young talent that we have.

There is no question about it. Our only course of option is to \"go young.\" Hopefully we win some games, but we won't be trying to win at the expense of developing our core for the future. For that matter, how could we even attempt to \"win now?\" We can't bring in any players because our payroll is strapped. For that matter, we still need to get rid of one player to get our roster down to 15 (which is the league maximum.)

Hopefully, rather than avoiding signing Richard, we will be able to pull of a two for one or buy out one of the expirings. I think we will sign him because of the promotions that he has done, such as the state fair, but you never really know.

My guess is that we sign Richard as well... but who goes? Easiest to move is probably Ricky and/or McCants, but I doubt that happens (even though I want it too.) We don't have too many buyout options available either.

@ Signing Richard

I hope for that, too. We could use any big body we could on this squad full of guards, especially if he shows promises of becoming a \"banger\", something KG always lacked on his side *sigh*.

Like I said before, I think the only players able to draw some kind of interest from other teams are Ricky Davis and maybe Trenton Hassell, because they could be valuable role players on a championship caliber team. For some time, there were rumors that someone was interested in Marco Jaric (forgot who it was supposed to be), but I could hardly believe that. With McCants...I don't know, who really would want to gamble on an unproven, microfracturely repaired, undersized shooting guard with a shaky shot? But maybe you have heard rumors I have not...

And there is still the trade request of Juwan Howard. I guess he will find suitors, because of his veteran experience and proven chracter. The question is...can the Wolves pass on his leadership and locker room presence? Do they really want the veteran influence on the young guys to come from Ricky Davis and Mark Blount???

Sanyarin wrote:
The rumor was Jaric to Detroit if I am remembering correctly. I agree with you that we could find a place for Hassell and Davis. I really wish that we could find a team that wants Blount. CW always wants to get rid of McCants. There is no rumor unless he started it. I also agree that they need to get these guys off the team before they influence the young guys.

mwithers wrote:

Uhhhhh.... remember that... errr... rumor about McCants to........... The Clippers I believe it was? Yeah, I think they were going to send us...... ummm probably Maggette for like McCants and filler. Ummm.... hmmm... you're right, I got nothin.

Thank you MWithers for that reminder...now I do indeed remember. The deal I heard about was Jaric for Nazr Mohammed who never found his place as a thought replacement for Big Ben. I hoped for this trade to happen while KG was still around, so there would have finally been one big body whose owner can at least spell d-e-f-e-n-s-e to protect him. But KG's gone and I guess the deal's of the table anyways, since the Pistons have drafted some guards already.

Btw: I remember being happy hearing that Jaric was traded to the wolves (although I wished only for Sam, not the additional pick), because Jaric always used to kill me on my NBA Video Games . Sadly, he plays himself far worse that the A.I. did !

EDIT: A.I. is artificial intelligence, isn't it? Kind of looks like Allen Iverson, though...we call it K.I. here in Germany...the computer brain, not \"The Answer\" !

Davis, Blount, and Hassell are the three vets on this team who are worth keeping around. They're the only three good enough to serve as building blocks for this team as we try to rebuild.

Out of the three, Blount's the only one I'm really itching to get rid of. I see him being a problem in the locker room. I don't think that McCants or Brewer will ever be the scoring threat that Ricky D is, so I'd actually like to see him stay for a reasonable price. I don't think we'll get a windfall of youngsters for him, so we may as well use his 17ppg as a nice compliment to the future tandem of Jefferson and Foye.

Hassell's contract will keep us from getting anything good for him in return. He's a class act and a good dender, so I'm happy to to have him around.

Ahhh... somebody finally sticks up for good 'ol Trenton. I love that guy and I hope he doesn't get traded.

I can't shake the feeling that we are going to end up trading away ALL of our veterans. You know, you have to have somebody to teach the youngsters how to play. Foye is in his 2nd year, he's not a vet yet.

I'd like to see a starting lineup like this (forgive me if I don't get all of the positions correctly, I'm not the most knowledgeable basketball person)

PG: Foye (who else do we have? Telfair is a really risky player IMHO....)
PF: Jefferson (Smith off the bench)
SF: Hassell (Brewer off the bench, two good lockdown defenders here)
C: Blount, could have Howard here too? Is he really a center?
SG: Davis (not sure for a 2nd stringer here)

singhcr wrote:

Good post, I agree. I'm all for dumping Blount and Marko if possible, but we need at least a few veterans. It looks like we're probably gonna keep Ricky Davis. I'd say we should keep Hassell too. I'd also like to keep Howard if he doesn't mind staying to be a mentor and has a good attitude (which doesn't seem to be the case, which we can all see from his \"demands\" to be traded.) It looks like Theo Ratliff will be staying so that his expiring contract is able to expire. That's fine, he won't play much anyways (if at all.)

Anyhow, your roster layout is pretty accurate. Don't forget Gomes. He'll possibly be our starting SF. If not, he'll backup the SF and PF. Davis's backups are currently a combination of Jaric, Gerald Green, and McCants. We have a major logjam at the 2 and 3 positions (SG and SF) and trying to find enough minutes for all these guys. It's not an enviable task. I think it would be amazing if we could get rid of Marko and/or McCants to free up minutes for Gerald Green and Brewer backing up Gomes/Hassell/Davis.

I'm currently writing a Wolves-article for the Danish NBA-website I'm a part of. We write articles for every team each year, and once again, I'm stuck with Minnesota. I say stuck, because this year, it's terrible trying to create a starting lineup.

First of all, I would love us to go small and play Jefferson on the five. I think we have the team to do that, but last year our rebounding average pretty much sucked, and that won't help to improve it.

Anyway, I would love a starting lineup that read:

PG: Foye
SG: Davis/McCants
SF: Hassell
PF: Smith
C: Jefferson

I looove Craig Smith, and I hope he can continue his development, even with extra competition at PF and SF, where he played a lot last season. But we should get rid of Ricky, Jaric and Blount IMO. But this is not a perfect world, I know.

Howard can play the five-spot. He played there when Yao got hurt last season, with Battier on the four. Talk about going small.

I have made my point - in this thread and other ones - a few times already, but in response to Zonker I would once again reiterate my statement strictly against going small, like he proposes.

Leaving aside the question if Big Al has the tools to be a legitimate center even in a league in which an increasing number of teams tries to emulate Phoenix’ style of play and if he could not maximize his talents playing PF, especially paired with the more outside oriented game of Mark Blount at C, freeing up the middle for him to take advantage of the opposing forward…my main problem with that approach is the Cookie Monster. I just do not believe that he is starting PF material in this league…not yet and if ever. Having exchanged body fat for muscle will surely increase his production and I am sure he will be a valuable asset to this team, but he still remains a second year, second round pick with little experience and most of all…he still is extremely undersized for his position.

I just do not think that pitting him against the strong PFs in the West, featuring the likes of Timmy-D, Stoudemire, Boozer, Brand (if he comes back) and Dirk on a regular basis is a good idea. And leaving the West aside, there are still some games to be played against Eastern Teams fielding PFs like O’Neal, Bosh and some guy named Garnett. I do not know exactly what everybody else on this board thinks about such matchups, but for myself: They make me shiver. There is a fine line between fielding a young player against good opposition to let him learn from the best and getting him exposed over and over agin, thereby destroying his confidence. Personally I think the established PFs in this league would eviscerate poor Craig night in-and-night-out, hurting not only his development and his confidence in himself, but also the team, both short and longterm.

On the other hand, fielding him against the opponents' secondary, I think he will be able to do a lot of damage, as his performance in the Summer League promised. And with a starting five probably inferior to the top or even mid-level teams of the west (either because of lacking talent or lacking experience), but given with a pretty interchangeable roster down to position 9 or 10, the Wolves will be smart to create a strong secondary unit to stay alive in games in which the starting five will be clearly overmatched. And when Jefferson and Smith start, and assuming that Howard gets traded (which is a likely scenario), whom do you bring of the bench to spell the aforementioned two? Blount? Madsen? Thedleaguecentresignedtoreplacemadsen? I just do not like that tought.

So I don’t say that the T-Wolves shouldn’t go small from time to time in a game to give the opponent a different look, but establishing that as the main approach seems ill-suited considering the roster the T-Wolves have.


Another thought on Smith:
Maybe I misunderstood Zonker on that one (if so, I apologize), but Craig Smith is definitely no SF. He lacks the necessary quickness to defend his opponents on the perimeter or in the open half court as well as the sort of inside-out game a modern SF needs on the offensive end. It’s a pity, because his size is more suited for a SF and his superior brawn would make him a great scorer in the post-up-game, but that just won’t work out.

And on Shaddy:
Opposed to some other and very elaborate opinions on this board, I am not convinced that we should get rid of him as soon as possible, both because I am still not sure that we’ve seen all from him after his microfracture surgery and because I just don’t believe anybody would want him, but…starting spot? For an unproven, streaky, undersized, supposedly athletically gifted SG with surgically repaired knees?? Dividing the remaining minutes between a identicall but bigger and healthier type of player with a better shot (Green) and the only guy on the T-Wolves roster who has proven he can drop 20 pts. on every opponent every night (Davis, who you want to have traded - me, too - but nontheless)? Oh, come on !

Sanyarin wrote:
I know he's no SF and an in a perfect world he wouldn't play there, but he played that position on many occasions last year nonetheless. He was the main reason why Reed's minutes got reduced from the year before. I think it was a way to give him minutes, and apparently he didn't perform that bad.

And on Shaddy:
I love Shaddy too. And I actually thought that I was the only person who saw him having a future on this Wolves-team, despite his lack of playing defence. And the starting spot I suggested, was only if he showed that potential I know he's got. And lastly, I would never suggest that lineup if I was asked to give my true opinion. That was more of a wishlist from my behalf..